Availability of Consciousness

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Re: Availability of Consciousness

Post  hen on Fri Jun 12, 2009 12:14 am

@proey
well my theory was that consciousness is a sort of manifestation of the soul which is in the quantum domain, so following that theory consciousness would be a property of the physical domain.

@andy
Actually, it's all very much like ghosts possessing people and objects. Since ghosts, considering they exist, may very well be our souls, yea, anything has the potential to be occupied by a soul.

But then you can't accomplish a whole lot from possessing a twig or trash on the floor, which is probably why most of these things are no more than matter.

Maybe when people claim to feel a consciousness from objects, they are actually feeling the consciousness of a soul possessing it.


I'm so full of theories today.
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Re: Availability of Consciousness

Post  BC on Fri Jun 12, 2009 12:17 am

Brenda,
I thought you were dead, but it seems now, you have succeeded in saving the world from tripod saw II members, by passing them AIDS, and you now you have a baby, alien too. Congratulations.

things that are unable to move might be able to have soul within them. Maybe this planet is shared, rocks acutally are alive, and its maybe because we view things in the snap shot way, so we cannot see the rocks living, and slurping up moles, and digest earthworms+mice. Their movement is invisible to us.

wtf
Sorry, Anyways, everything seems to coexist, but for our better understand the energies are classified into different levels. Some energy levels move on into the right direction, some go left. What makes this all different is that, ....rocks, as far as we know, do not show a sign of consciousness. We dont see rocks bouncing over to a shady part of the park to cool off from the heat of the sun. We might be able to go into the rock and feel its presence and energy by meditating and then surging into the rock. But there is no consciousness that is highly defined in it. Mostly just energy, and attraction.

The wind moves, we cant see it but we feel the breeze, we cant smell it but the zeypher flows into our hairy nostrils. Does it have a soul inside it? No babe, for BC it does not, because the wind is probably attracted by our current emotions and bought to us. Just like the tree waving thing. Although my tree didnt wave...but some guys got theirs to move and say HI to them. This shows that somethings might not have awareness inside them, but they do have the potential to merge and develop or merge with one when an activator of consciousness is present. The wind does not have life. Humans gave it life through metaphor, poetry, folk tales.

Brenda, I thought you were dead too.

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Re: Availability of Consciousness

Post  Andy.S on Fri Jun 12, 2009 9:56 pm

HAHAHAHAHAHA

Awesome Cindy (Bradley), that’s some serious @#$% you got there!

What you say sort of clarifies that not every energy form contributes to inner consciousness. Energy is everywhere, everything, and nothing at the same time. It is the building blocks of physical matter and living creatures. The reason why we are so different is because each energy frequency is different and unique; it comes in many forms. I assume that consciousness itself is just one form of energy that some things can have. Truthfully, we DON'T know whether everything has consciousness...because our brains cannot pick up every change of energy nor feel every touch of Being. Immobile objects can emit energy and consciousness...but it is too weak or undetectable by human beings...So...what we can conclude goes back to common sense: unanimated matter gives normal human beings no sign of greater consciousness.

Alright, now that we got through that part...how would you classify an artificially intelligent robot as living, non-living...or consciousness, unconsciousness? (Assuming the robot is super high tech machine that’s NOT some stupid Japanese robot doll crap)
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Re: Availability of Consciousness

Post  Angel on Sat Jun 13, 2009 6:06 pm

What you say sort of clarifies that not every energy form contributes to inner consciousness. Energy is everywhere, everything, and nothing at the same time. It is the building blocks of physical matter and living creatures. The reason why we are so different is because each energy frequency is different and unique; it comes in many forms. I assume that consciousness itself is just one form of energy that some things can have.
Exactly what I’m beginning to see now.
Yes, energy is everywhere; it is around and about us all the time. Nonliving things and inanimate objects often give off waves or frequencies of energy, but that does not necessarily translate into them possessing higher powers of consciousness. Do only things that feel (I’m not going beyond to know, since I do not believe that levels of intelligence and comprehension take a part in the determining of consciousness) have this kind of energy within them? (Within, therefore they are able to exhibit or give off the air of energy). And then, do only things that have “high feeling” (like “high intelligence”) possess consciousness? Does this consciousness disappear or appear only fleetingly of its own accord, thus making it slightly apart from the mind and the being, as well as the physical body?
Alright, now that we got through that part...how would you classify an artificially intelligent robot as living, non-living...or consciousness, unconsciousness?

Oh, it’s certainly living – in its own manner. But it does not live with a heart; it doesn’t stand with natural limbs and features that are triggered by inner emotions and feelings. It is not man (or any other animal/species/naturally living thing); it is man-made. Clearly, there’s a distinction there. I would think that the artificially intelligent robot is nonliving and unconsciousness. It is only made living and conscious, I think, because it is structured and in a sense “ordered” to be so. It is purely material … which, to me, does not exist as something that is vulnerable. It can be broken, but not hurt (again: things that feel). This leads me to another thought … do only vulnerable things, entities that are inevitable subjects to harm, have these varying frequencies of consciousness within them (not around and about them)?
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Re: Availability of Consciousness

Post  joyceychen on Sat Jun 13, 2009 7:33 pm

hm...while reading through the responses, i've been thinking, (i think i asked this earlier) - whats the difference between being and consciousness? maybe what we're labeling as consciousness, especially in inanimate or "dead" forms of matter (or energy, as some of us would say) is actually being, assuming that there is a difference between the two
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Re: Availability of Consciousness

Post  Fionaaa :) on Sun Jun 14, 2009 12:02 am

Alright, now that we got through that part...how would you classify an artificially intelligent robot as living, non-living...or consciousness, unconsciousness?
didn't the bio books have a list of things that living things exhibit? i think it included reproduction, heredity...and a few other things. So unless the artificially intelligent robot is able to reproduce and pass down its genes, it probably shouldn't and wouldn't be classified as living.
the definition of "conscious" is according to dictionary.com: aware of one's own existence, sensations, thoughts, surroundings, etc. so yes, maybe a robot can be programmed to respond and be aware of sensations around it, but can they really be aware of their own existence? Everything they do would be given to them by humans. doesn't that make them have a consciousness created by us?
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Re: Availability of Consciousness

Post  John on Sun Jun 14, 2009 7:20 am

As I understand it, (All That Is) is conscious of itself and the sourse of all things is aware of it. The dead body knows it held the life force of a human. The AI robot is aware of itself and also has a perspective of itself. The tree understands it purpose in the greater scheme of things.

The essence of all things is energy and energy is formless. When energy takes on form it retains its awareness yet it may well confine some aspects of its awareness so that the form will sharpen its focus appropriately. The human person is a great example of that.

As I see it, the life force factor an aspect of any form. The rock does not grow more of its form like the plant or the animal. Yet a crystal is said to be able to hold, retain, and express from its memory an extensive amount of information.

In each case the form has purpose. The formless essence behind it understands what it is doing and I suspect is happy to be a part of All That Is.

John
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Re: Availability of Consciousness

Post  Luoh on Sun Jun 14, 2009 12:32 pm

Well, in answer to the robot question, i don't believe that robots can have consciousness. A rock might have consciousness because while it is not a "living" thing, it was part of this world since the beginning, thus having some type of consciousness.
A robot on the other hand, would have a consciousness, but it would be an artificial one, not something that it had by it self, but something created by humans, thus AI or artificial intelligence

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Re: Availability of Consciousness

Post  Angel on Sun Jun 14, 2009 2:51 pm

whats the difference between being and consciousness? maybe what we're labeling as consciousness, especially in inanimate or "dead" forms of matter (or energy, as some of us would say) is actually being, assuming that there is a difference between the two
I don’t know if this is correct, but I think that being encompasses consciousness. Both travel on in forms of energy and spirit and may linger on after animate forms of life become inanimate, but I think the definition of consciousness (if there actually is one that is universally agreed upon) falls within that of being. If one is being, one is living, breathing, doing, thinking, believing, listening, and carrying out all other sorts of functions. One distinction that I previously proposed was that consciousness didn’t really refer to or rely on the levels of intelligence or any high-level form of existing. If one is conscious, one feels and responds to sight and touch, and is aware. But one does not have to be continuously present in the Now and be in the present moment to be conscious. I don’t know; it’s just a personal opinion I have here. Smile
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Re: Availability of Consciousness

Post  Andy.S on Sun Jun 14, 2009 9:38 pm

Fiona
we are not just using the dictionary definition of conciousness, but also the Vibrational Medicine Guide one. From what the discussion has gone to, we are trying to classify stuff based on the idea of energy and consciousness...since almost everyone assumes that everything is made of energy and possibly contains some consciousness.



Luoh
Surely AI/robots are made from many different parts right? If one says a piece of metal has literally no or less conciousness, what would happen if we combine them with other things and built...maybe a exact model of a human brain but made from metal and stuff...I assume that the pieces of different consciousness from each element would then become merged into one single entity; a higher level of consciousness...


Angel
Yes, I would assume that Being encompasses consciousness because we do not see life in the dead ( the soul has moved on). However, what if one argues that dead things can have consciousness soley on the fact that it is still giving off energy ( when it is decomposing) Or does consciousness require retained energy, not leaving ones?..
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Re: Availability of Consciousness

Post  Andy.S on Mon Jun 15, 2009 7:34 pm

WOW.
I can't believe mod week is over already...I still have so much to question...dang
But no fear, each and every single one of your responses has brought insight that shall aid me through my quest.
I thank you all and wish you good luck.


BYE pirat
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Re: Availability of Consciousness

Post  Vincent_Lee on Mon Jun 15, 2009 9:07 pm

Andy.S wrote:Alright, now that we got through that part...how would you classify an artificially intelligent robot as living, non-living...or consciousness, unconsciousness? (Assuming the robot is super high tech machine that’s NOT some stupid Japanese robot doll crap)

Well, all great inventions have humble beginnings no? Like how a computer programmed to play "a mean game of chess" eventually becoame an artificially intelligent system that become self-aware and proceeded to nuke the hell out of humanity. Just like how in the "Cave Days" we killed each other with sticks and stones and nowadays we have all sorts of fancy toys and machinery to blow each other up with. As time passes and humans gain more knowledge and become more sophisticated, so do the tools they produce, the activities engage in, the thoughts they think, and the things they do.

Who is to say robots can't do the same things we do in the future? If you break humans and robots down to their components, we are not super different. We both run on fuels. Humans run on chemical fuel (food) and robots run on electrical fuel. What are our thoughts? Chemical and electrical signals. What are a computer or robot's thoughts? Bits of ones and zeros, computer coding, a "language" in itself. We've learned in English and AP Psych that our cells possess a basic intelligence and capacity for communication. Perhaps a robot's coding is the same? Right now though, the programming of many robots only allows them to execute a few simple actions. I'm confident as technology improves, robots will become more and more sophisticated, like humans.

Will they gain consciousness? Eventually, I think. As the AI grows more complex, I would think so. Or perhaps they already have consciousness. Without a language though, how is consciousness communicated? Perhaps it exists in computers and machines already, but we have no way of finding out. We have yet to create a machine that can measure energy or "Being". Once we do, perhaps a lot of questions will be answered.

This is a very complex question I think, and requires a comprehensive understanding of concepts like consciousness to answer. Good question, really. I think this is all I can offer for now, even though your week is over. But hey, it's not like the thread's locked right? Laughing

Until then though, watch more TSCC. Hope they revive the series and give us fans a Season 3.
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